Take a break. Walk away from it.
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Foxbody 4.6 Dohc Swap
- Thread starter ponyboy89lx
- Start date
I think i will i finished out the day with no instrument cluster lightS, no horn, no wipers, and the CCRM buzzing and no starter engage. ITS BREAK TIME FOR SURE LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Capri_gt
Well-Known Member
Yea man dont give up just walk away for a little while. I thought about selling my capri when I found out the fuel pump was dead. It was the last straw lol but I left it alone for a while and im about to jump back at it here in a few days. Dont give up or youll regret letting it go.
4whldisc
Active Member
DONTSTOP NOW,you are too close!!! have you checked all the grounds. you may be getting a backfeed to the defrost sw when the switch is in the start position. in the start position, only the items required to start the car are powered, everything else wipers, heater etc is switched off. a poor ground can sometimes light up switch illuminations and other strange problems as the car will be searching for a ground. as you know, a poor ground can also burn-out a throttle cable, and other things. check the battery to the engine, engine to body etc. when a large amperage draw light a starter operation exists, a high resistance in a ground circuit can cause all sorts of problems.
4whldisc
Active Member
have you checked all the grounds. battery to engine, battery to body, dash to body,poor grounds can cause all sorts of problems like back feeding. if you find the starter relay, short pins 30 & 87, (if you have a standard 5 pin starter relay) if the starter cranks the engine both main circuits (pwr & gnd for the starter) are intact. if it doesnt crank, you may want to do some volt drop tests on the pwr & ground circuits.
which loom are you using.
when you do this many mods to a car, you'll always have teething problems, it will give you something to laugh about later.
which loom are you using.
when you do this many mods to a car, you'll always have teething problems, it will give you something to laugh about later.
I narrowed the CCRM buzzing down to the fuel pump relay inside the CCRM. I can remove the fuel pump fuse in the engine bay fuse box and buzzing stops, also i can unplug the connector at the tank down to the pump it stops, also unplug the connector in passenger side kick panel next to the computer it stops, i think it is a ground somewhere. Gonna go over them real good in the next day or so and see what happens. Thanks every one for the replies. On the wipers i have power to two of the wires in the plug that plugs in the wiper motor so i dont know whats up with that and i didnt even try to figure the horn and instrument lights.
All the research i have done leads to a bad ground or the CCRM but when i got the chip to turn of PATS everything worked like it should besides the lights and wipers, the fuel pump cycle just like normal with NO ccrm buzzing then all the sudden i have buzzing, could possibly be a bad computer but i think its a ground somewhere.
4whldisc
Active Member
generally speaking, a bad ground would cause a relay to buzz. grounds can be tricky to diagnose at times, sometimes you can test the ground with an ohm meter and get a good reading of .2 ohms, but the circuit will still not be able to carry a load.
to conduct a ohms test using an ohm meter try putting one m/meter lead on the wiring eylet and the other m/meter lead on the body. however i would suggest to do a volt drop test of the ground wire, as this is more accurate.the position of the test leads would be the same as above, however the power would need to be switched on. a reading of .2 volts would be acceptable.
if you dont have an ohm meter you can use a headlight bulb to conduct a load test of the ground circuit. hook one end of the head light wire to the end of the ccrm connector ground wires, and the other end of the headlight wire anywhere to the body, the headlight should glow at full brightness and stay bright. this will put aprox a 4.5 amp load thru the ground circuit. obviously you will have to extend the wire on the headlight bulb connector. i would suggest using the old square style halogen bulb as it doesn't get as hot to hold or blind you, either way the results are the same, if the light remains lit up at full brightness, the circuit should be considered intact.
if the ground circuit is intact, there is additional testing that can be performed.
generally speaking, if the pcm has failed the milage in the digital odometer will show dashes-or the fan will come on when the ignition switch is turned on. if all else fails, remove the chip and retest.
to conduct a ohms test using an ohm meter try putting one m/meter lead on the wiring eylet and the other m/meter lead on the body. however i would suggest to do a volt drop test of the ground wire, as this is more accurate.the position of the test leads would be the same as above, however the power would need to be switched on. a reading of .2 volts would be acceptable.
if you dont have an ohm meter you can use a headlight bulb to conduct a load test of the ground circuit. hook one end of the head light wire to the end of the ccrm connector ground wires, and the other end of the headlight wire anywhere to the body, the headlight should glow at full brightness and stay bright. this will put aprox a 4.5 amp load thru the ground circuit. obviously you will have to extend the wire on the headlight bulb connector. i would suggest using the old square style halogen bulb as it doesn't get as hot to hold or blind you, either way the results are the same, if the light remains lit up at full brightness, the circuit should be considered intact.
if the ground circuit is intact, there is additional testing that can be performed.
generally speaking, if the pcm has failed the milage in the digital odometer will show dashes-or the fan will come on when the ignition switch is turned on. if all else fails, remove the chip and retest.
I have 94-98 dash, and i removed chip with same result im going to try to go over it today with a fine tooth comb and see if i can get it to crank. I need to buy a volt meter all i use it a tiny test light all the time lol
Kurt
Active Member
LMAO I know its pathetic lol
well i got the buzzing to stop in the CCRM, but the starter still will not engage, it works i checked it manually. Also the defrost light is still flashing when i try to start, also the IAC solenoid is clicking while i try to start dont know whats up with that, I am using the mark VIII engine harness i wonder if this is the problem, i hate to buy a cobra engine harness if its not gonna fix the issue, does anyone know if the pinouts are different where it hooks to the ECM harness,
Man I have no idea...
I dont either i getting fed up really quick i could cut my losses now and make most of the money back, but if i go farther im toasted lol. I thought everything would be good with the total harness swap guess i thought wrong, only harness i didnt get was the engine harness so ??????????????
Maybe if you got a complete, unmolested harness out of the same vehicle (cobra or GT) and started over, you might have better luck instead of trying to make the Mark harness work with the Cobra harness.
I think the harness is some issue because its from a 93 Mark VIII, so i think im gonna try to get a cobra harness and go from there. lol more $$$$$$$$$$
4whldisc
Active Member
Perhaps it would be best to tackle one problem at a time. you seem to be concerned with the starter issue now.
If you look at the basic starter circuit itself, it is relatively primitive. The battery supplies voltage to the starter at all times. The starter also requires a ground; this can be a dedicated ground or using the engine as a ground provided there is a good ground from the battery to the engine.
There is a neutral start (transmission range sensor) on the transmission, and a little starter relay in the fuse box under the hood to fire off the starter solenoid.
Where it gets kind of tricky is do you have anti-theft. Anti-theft and PATS are not the same. Anti-theft kills the starter and operates the alarm, PATS disables the ignition & fuel.
When you mentioned you tested the starter, was it on the car or off. Did you fire off the starter by shorting the starter solenoid wire to battery wire at the starter or from the relay in the engine compartment fuse box or from the rear of the car?
Do you have a wiring diagram for both the donor car and the engine wiring for the MKVIII? Does the dash wiring match to body loom or are they from different cars. What specific year is the body & dash loom.
Was the dash you are using come from a V6 or V8 car?
One the starter issue is resolved, we can move on to the next issue of your choice.
Sorry to be persist, i'm not trying to take over this posting, but it seems that you have done so much work and are so close to reaping the fruits of your labor, i just wanted to help.
If you look at the basic starter circuit itself, it is relatively primitive. The battery supplies voltage to the starter at all times. The starter also requires a ground; this can be a dedicated ground or using the engine as a ground provided there is a good ground from the battery to the engine.
There is a neutral start (transmission range sensor) on the transmission, and a little starter relay in the fuse box under the hood to fire off the starter solenoid.
Where it gets kind of tricky is do you have anti-theft. Anti-theft and PATS are not the same. Anti-theft kills the starter and operates the alarm, PATS disables the ignition & fuel.
When you mentioned you tested the starter, was it on the car or off. Did you fire off the starter by shorting the starter solenoid wire to battery wire at the starter or from the relay in the engine compartment fuse box or from the rear of the car?
Do you have a wiring diagram for both the donor car and the engine wiring for the MKVIII? Does the dash wiring match to body loom or are they from different cars. What specific year is the body & dash loom.
Was the dash you are using come from a V6 or V8 car?
One the starter issue is resolved, we can move on to the next issue of your choice.
Sorry to be persist, i'm not trying to take over this posting, but it seems that you have done so much work and are so close to reaping the fruits of your labor, i just wanted to help.
Thanks for the info 4whldisc, to answer some of the questions, i have the old mark VIII starter in the car so it needs to be changed to the cobra starter ( it hooks up different than the cobra ) so I tried the cobra starter off the car buy jumping it off with battery charger. Because i used the Mark oil pan and i have long tubes so i have to drop the k-member to replace the starter (PIA). So i then attempted to get it to engage off the car but could not get it to do anything. I never tried to jump it at the relay in the fuse box. I have a chip to turn PATS off, im running a five speed so the neutral saftey switch is pedal activated correct, I have the entire harness from a 96 mystic cobra minus the injector harness and transmission harness, also the dash is from the same car. I personally think i need to bite the bullet and change the starter. IMO i think its a ground issue it should atleast crank over, might not start but it should try to crank lol, but it wont crank the starter over but like i said the starter is not on the car and is not really grounded good enough i think. I gonna try to get the starter off and the cobra starter on today, this should be fun lol. Also found a cobra injector harness for a very reasonable price, so gotta get that on the way.
I gotta go tomorrow and get the SN95 lower dash mounts thats on the trans tunnel and cut the steering shaft bearing out of the firewall, then i guess i will drop a motor and replace some stuff lol sounds like tons of fun huh. Anyways i thought i would be over my budget of 3500 in this car but im still doing alright on it i rough figured it and im probably around 3000 right now so i aint doing bad. I still need a 8.8 though and a set of gears but that can come later. I am doing the body work and paint myself so i dont count that in on the budget, just count the cost of materials.
Well i got a little more stuff then planned ended up picking up a new grey and black SN95 dash and console with shifter boot to match my origanal fox grey and black interior, also got trans tunnel with dash brackets PLUS a set of 3650 crossmember body mounts!!!!!, and got the steering bearing for 100 bucks i felt bad so i gave 120 LOL. Gotta love good friends. Oh yeah got my plug wires today so plenty of work today in the next day or so.